Name: Inside North America’s Sustainability Shift: Research, Readiness & Reality
Uploaded: 2026-05-19T16:16:18.393Z
Duration: 59 min 36 s
Description: Inside North America’s Sustainability Shift: Research, Readiness & Reality

Transcript for "Inside North America’s Sustainability Shift: Research, Readiness & Reality": To this Sustainability Magazine webinar. My name is Charlie King, and I am the senior editor of Sustainability Magazine. And I'm joining you for a special North America focused conversation on the evolving state of sustainability reporting. Today's webinar is brought to you in partnership with KPMG and Osapiens, and we'll be unpacking the findings from a newly released benchmarking report exploring how organizations across The US and Canada are approaching sustainability reporting, where they're progressing, where they're struggling, and what leading companies are doing differently. Today's session is titled inside North America's sustainability shift, research, readiness, and reality. Regulatory pressure is increasing, investor scrutiny is intensifying, and organizations are being asked to deliver data that is transparent, auditable, and decision ready. Yet most companies are still in transition. Only 16% feel fully prepared for climate and sustainability reporting requirements. 56.5% say that they are mostly prepared but need stronger integration and controls. 27.4% remain early stage. Compliance is the primary driver for 73.4% of organizations alongside glowing growing focus on risk, visibility, and investor confidence. The message here is clear. Sustainability reporting is no longer optional, and maturity gaps remain. Over the next sixty or so minutes, we are going to explore exactly what this means, and the actions that organizations must take to stay competitive. I want to extend a warm welcome to our guests for this. So I'm really pleased to be joined by Josh Hesterman, advisory managing director at KPMG, Stephen Copley, North America regional lead at Osapiens, and Marcus Leach, managing director in KPMG's US strategy. Thank you so much, to the three of you for joining me. Can you please start just by introducing yourselves, a little bit about you, and and your background? Josh, do you wanna kick us off? Certainly. Thanks, Charlie. Again, Josh Hesterman, managing director in KPMG's U US advisory and sustainability practice. I work primarily with industrial manufacturing and private equity clients to, bring what is traditionally a compliance and regulatory focus set of, requirements into, a value based domain. So whereas, we're gonna talk a lot today, think about, you know, where those two intersect, that really is, is kind of the focus of of my work. Great to be here. Thanks. Thank you. And Marcus? Thanks, Charlie. It's great to be here. Hello, everyone. Marcus Leech, managing director within US KPMG US's strategy practice. Similar to Josh, focus on a lot of sustainability related considerations, and lead teams that cover quite a broad swath of of sustainability topics inclusive of of energy resilience, climate risk, nature and biodiversity, water, etcetera. But most of my time is is helping sync up, company's overarching strategy with their sustainability strategy. So whether that is materiality determinations, whether that is reporting and disclosure considerations on the tail end or otherwise, it's helping to, move from strategy to execution around these sustainability domains. I focus mainly on the tech, media, and telecom sector, but have served a number of of large clients globally in all sectors. Great to be here. Brilliant. And Steven? Hi, everybody. Steven Cloughlin here. Nice to be with you. I'm leading the charge commercially, at least, for, Osapiens in North America. I've been with the company for a couple of years. I've come from nineteen years at the SAP America, whereas responsible for technologies around track and trace and compliance, not a million miles away from our topic today in some respects, globally. So, again, happy to be here. Brilliant. And thank you again, all three of you, for joining us. Marcus, do you wanna help us dive straight into this? How would you describe the current sustainability reporting landscape across North America? I'm happy happy to kick us off, and that's a great great question to start. I would describe it as, complex, confusing, not sure what's next. I I I don't know what other what other ways to describe it. But I I think it's fast moving, and there's there's quite a a few moving parts right now. So with that said, we've got a number of state level regulations. So think of of California related related climate rules. We have global regulations that impact US domiciled entities, like European related sustainability reporting, CSRD or otherwise. We have, energy related considerations that that flow into decision making that also have, sort of downstream disclosure and reporting considerations. So there's this pretty broad ecosystem of of regulatory pressures alongside invest broader investor and stakeholder pressures. So there's this mix of of regulation and stakeholder pressures that are resulting in more rigorous disclosure requirements globally, and that that's certainly what we found from from our surveys and and our client discussions, here in The US as well. Josh, how is it from your perspective? Are we seeing more proactive strategy, or is it primarily compliance one in action? Yeah. Well, I think, Charlie, you had the, the numbers there in the in the intro. So I I do think that there is a huge focus on, compliance and satisfying the regulatory obligations that are that are on the table. But, interestingly, I think this is one of those situations where while the numbers, don't necessarily lie, they they do bend the truth a little bit or maybe obscure, some of the more salient, salient facts that that underlie it. Mainly that, I think that as companies get into, into understanding what their regulatory obligations look like, they start to to scratch the surface at something that's a lot more, useful, which is what is the real value that that underlies all of, all of this, you know, because this is not, simply, we hope that it's not regulation for regulation's sake. We hope that really it is driving, greater transparency into different aspects of, of a company's performance and that, over time, we we begin to, to be able to to track and understand the performance and the impact of that when it comes to the financials and to the p and l of the the company itself. And so I think, well, it's certainly, an easier answer and, and it's simpler to say that I'm, you know, doing this for regulatory purposes is to, to start with. I really think that belies a a much more, sort of multifaceted and interesting, interesting truth that's under there. And I think as as far as my clients go, as soon as they start down that that journey of, you know, of meeting the regulation, that's when they start to get to the really, the really juicy stuff that, that gets them excited and gets the rest of the organization excited too. Steven, I mean, we've seen this research showing that only 16% of companies feel fully prepared. How are you seeing companies respond to the growing reporting complexity? Are we seeing long term capabilities being built, or is it sort of more tactical reaction? We've seen, so far a little bit more of the latter, I'm afraid, you know, a little bit more tactical. And some of that has been around, you know, changes that are going on in the regulations creating a certain sort of exhaustion maybe from some from some corners. But also that, simple, simply not knowing that there's aware simply not there being in the in the market awareness that there are tools to help in this. It's it's it's seen as something that's kind of like a consulting engagement, which is, of course, a significant part of it. But there are tools underlying all of that that can really help, develop a more consistent approach here. So it's changing, for sure. And especially this year, we saw a little bit more tactical and disembodied kind of engagements around it last year. This year, it's we're we're seeing a lot more of the businesses out there that they're in that we're interacting with being more strategic about it. So it's changing fast. I feel like regulation is an ongoing journey, isn't it? But 2025, definitely, in in Europe, particularly, I feel exhaustion is certainly the word. What are the most common gaps you're seeing, for these organizations that are describing themselves and mostly prepared? Data, governance, technology, ownership, where are you seeing those those gaps? I would say technology mainly, followed by maybe ownership. Technology for the reasons that I mentioned. I mean, for for the market to perceive that there there are tools out there like, like, Osakins that can do DMA, that can do the XBRL tagging, that can do the alignment of the data with the various, structures, the various standards that are out there. It just seems like a revelation. But in fact, these tools have been, in fact, you know, around for quite a while. So the technology and awareness of the technology is is one of the things that's held things back a little bit. And then linked to that is the is the ownership. You know, it's it's quite often the case, especially when you have identity with multiple affiliates, that the ownership is not really distributed, consistent with the ownership of of of the company. But KPMG, you might wanna jump in on this one. I mean, you probably see that a little bit as well. I I would agree with with Steven. I think Charlie touched on this this, you know, fast these regulations are evolving or the deregulation that is happening is is tough to keep up with. Right? In either direction. And I think the awareness that Steven called out is is what I see with a lot of clients, whether it's it's just simply keeping up with that ever evolving regulatory or or stakeholder changes to adapt, change course, you know, make sure you're getting done what you need to get done is is challenging. And I think the underlying structures to support those challenges, whether it's technology as as Steven alluded to, whether it's overarching governance or operating model or ownership that was described. I think we often see gaps there, and sort of that that, ability to take it forward into execution and action. There's a lot of a lot of times that we've seen, companies, sort of freeze, if you will, and and not know where to go next. And so that's, some of the the complexities and and gaps that I'm seeing. No. I don't wanna belabor the point necessarily, but I do think that there's a really when you look at kind of the arc of how organizations have stood up, similar capabilities to to handle different types of regulations that we look in the past to an analog like, like SOX reporting, and things of that nature. It is by by definition, a highly cross functional, exercise that you have to undertake. And I think that, where SOX started, you know, that practice of, of getting, you know, finance to speak more closely with, operations, to speak more closely with accounting, so on and so forth. I think when you look at the extent of what's required in sustainability, it is still, you know, a tier above that in terms of the level of complexity and cross functional integration that's required. And I I think that's also, one of the reasons why we're starting to see, you know, more more technology and governance solutions, at the forefront of people trying to pull this together because I think it's been, you know, largely a a people driven effort and and very, very much sort of idiosyncratic to organizations as they start to pull all these different, functions together. And now you need something to to begin to bind it, and make real decision making possible. And I I think we're, we're starting to see that, as different, solutions and tech providers come to the the space to fill fill that a bit. So, Josh, I always like to make sure that we make sure we've got actionable insights in these discussions. How should organizations balance these compliance requirements with long term value creation? Are are we looking to move to a space where reporting can move beyond box ticking to a strategic enabler? Without a doubt. I I think it's more a question of, of timing and speed than it is of, of whether it happens. I think that as we're talking about a bit earlier, we discussed, you know, this this ability to to kind of you scratch the surface, and then underneath, you see a lot of the the financial, implications that are underneath decisions regarding, your sustainability choices. And I say that, really the, you know, the only thing that is is sort of holding, holding a lot of, organizations back as having the right, you know, tools and kind of a common language to talk about, you know, value and about what the return on investment is. And again, I think we've got, you know, many, many years of, of that in in terms of practice in different financial domains. I think we need to take take that and continue to mature that, when it comes to, when it comes to sustainability. But I do think, especially, you know, a lot of, my clients who are are trying to push, you know, push this beyond compliance. They're spending a lot more time talking about what is the value framework that we're gonna align on, how are we going to get these disparate stakeholder groups, how to how to finance and get the CFOs, CFO's office to to buy off on on this. I think they're they're the ones that are gonna be the most successful, and it'll make the quickest pivot, from a purely sort of box checking exercise to, to something that really provides institutional value. Brilliant. I'm I'm keen to sort of keep pulling at this thread of of reporting as a competitive advantage. So, Marcus, can you dive a little bit in for me what audit ready sustainability reporting actually looks like in 2026? I'm I'm happy to. Not not an auditor, but but work for a a a very large, audit firm. So happy to to share, I think, some of the the considerations. I think my view is is overall audit ready sustainability reporting looks a lot more like financial reporting. So that transition to more clear accounting logic, more documentation around judgments that are made, and sort of the the most important attribute, I think, is that that traceable data from source to disclosure. So I think the the key to think about if you're listening is is not waiting for the auditor to ask, you know, why, how, or or who approved this. The the answer should already exist within your organization, and the technology data and processes to support the responses to those questions should already be in place prior to an auditor saying, where is it at etcetera. So I think it's that increased structure and and rigor and availability of answers before they are asked, is the way that I would think about audit ready sustainability reporting in 2026. The transparency is key. Right? I mean, we're seeing yeah, yeah, we're seeing more integration as as we continue down this line between supply chain risk management and sustainability data. Josh, how critical do you think supplier transparency is in achieving this credible reporting? Absolutely critical. I think, similar to, to Marcus's point around, getting the transparency for what we traditionally think of of kind of our own operations within a company, I think a lot of the regulation is already, you know, being very, very specific about the level of transparency you need up and down the the supply chain as a value chain. And so, it's gonna be, you know, increasingly important to understand, those sources, and disclosure that kind of pathway that we were describing. But at the same time, that's going to extend further and further into your supply chain as well. And so, what that ends up doing practically speaking, is reshaping a lot of the relationships that you, you have with your suppliers. I think the, the kind of foundational documents, the codes of conduct, and things of that nature that, that outline, you know, the service agreements and, what is delivered by when. I think those are gonna increasingly contain, you know, more and more, of this sustainability content. And as we, you know, see anytime that you're increasing the the sort of data, data request burden, it starts a bit, a bit rocky and you get a rough and ready, rough and ready presentation, and then, it slowly, gets better and and the data gets polished over time. But, but, yeah, I think that, you know, really, it's gonna require, extremely good, kind of over communication likely in the the near term with, key suppliers to make sure that they understand exactly what, will be required of them as as different disclosures, come to the floor, and then, everything that, the companies can do to to, you know, memorialize that in different documentation, so that they have, you know, they have a clear understanding of, who owes what when, is gonna be, you know, absolutely paramount for making these, these relations just work under a bit of new paradigm. Thinking with that sort of harmonization and and clarity, how how are you seeing for operations, organizations operating across The US and Canada and globally, how, how important do you see harmonization across frameworks thinking SEC requirements, ISB standards, ISSB standards, sorry, and similar? Yeah. Well, we'll see if, the SEC ever comes back on anything, and I'm not entirely hopeful there. But I do think that, that when we look at some of the other frameworks like ISSB, I think that we've got a bit of a, a pros and cons situation. I I think that they do present a really good, path to what, a more, fully harmonized set of frameworks could look like. But I think, that everyone is also being, very much eyes wide open about the amount of work that it takes to, to get to that. And, I mean, it doesn't take, doesn't take looking very, very far into the past. So looking at CSRD and the omnibus, and how that played out, and it's still playing out. I I think that, you know, we'll we'll likely see a similar level of, of integration and discussion around, you know, how do we actually harmonize this in a way that's, you know, providing us the data that we need and the outputs that, the market, wants to see while at the same time balancing. You know, is this too burdensome for companies of a specific size? So I think that, that is probably one of the biggest, biggest topical areas that I think will continue to get, get a lot of of play in airtime in the coming months and years is is really, you know, how much, how are we doing this balancing act, between what we think is market critical information, and the burden that it it places on, different parts of, parts of companies. I was just I was just gonna add, Charlie, the to Josh's commentary that that sort of interoperability across not only regulatory frameworks, but stakeholder requests, whether that's customers, investors, or otherwise. There are there are certainly attributes that cut across, you know, multiple, demands, regulatory or otherwise, that can help to shape sort of prioritization and where can we generate the most value, in areas that we might need to disclose most or that are most critical. And so I think that that step in identification and having the underlying structures and operating model to support that interoperability and value drivers is is really critical for for organizations. Marcus and Steven, I'm I'm keen to get both the sort of KPMG perspective and the Osapien side on this one. Where are you seeing the biggest impact from centralization and automation in sustainability reporting processes? I mean, I can I can you know, one one of the things that we've seen is just a sense of, you know, a renewed sense of purpose? Right? Yes. You can. Yes. We can. Right? This kind of thing. Because, you know, think about it that these disparate efforts to to look at scope three emissions, especially 3.1, to look at DMA, PAT, and then to do tagging so that you can integrate all of this wonderful stuff into in a consistent way into into reporting mechanisms. I mean, this is this is close to magic for many companies. You know? So the fact that you can the fact that the organization can see that there's a single platform that can bring all of this together and deal with it at the same time as evolving as the regulations involved, which is very, very topical, it creates just a real sense of purpose rather than something being kind of a drag. How are we ever gonna do this to being, hey. Here's something that can help us bring it all together. So and Marcus from the from the KPMG side might have come as well. Right? Yeah. No. Agree. I would say my view here is centralization and and sort of automation in general is helping to take a lot of disparate in manual coordination and manual processes across a whole lot of different stakeholder groups that Josh mentioned, this this large, you know, group of various stakeholders that need to be involved in in in these considerations. It's it's taking all of that and making it easier from a data traceability standpoint, version control standpoint, audit evidence standpoint, data collection standpoint. And what that offers is then more time to focus on more value add considerations like like Josh had mentioned earlier. So, you know, that ability to, have confidence in your data collection, and and sort of traceability structure allows for, you know, more time for action. And and that's, I think, what what we want out of this. So, I think leading organizations are are doing that really, really well, but there's still a lot of organizations with, you know, pen and paper, exchanges and, Excel files flying around everywhere every day. So Yeah. And I I may take that, one one step further, Marcus. I think that the, I I haven't, done, like, a set of hash marks for the number of times I've heard this, but the most common way that I've heard, clients refer their sustainability teams, is small but mighty. And so without fail, what we see from a functional or a capability standpoint is a group that, you know, is already being asked to do, more with less. I I know that that's a common theme across functions. Everyone is trying to, you know, create a more extensible working environment by, leveraging, artificial intelligence, etcetera. But I think that, when it comes to sustainability, I think that there is a, you know, a scrappy get it done, attitude that was already baked into, that kind of operating model and the the teams themselves from the very beginning. And so if they're going to, get beyond, the simple box ticking, of, regulation, which is not all that simple, I'll, I'll allow that. I I think that you almost, you almost require that centralization to be able to free up their time and kinda create force multipliers where they're getting a lot of work done, as easily as possible so they can focus on these other these other critical topics that'll move, the entire enterprise along a a good deal faster when it comes to the sustainability business case and argument. So I'm I'm sure lots of the sustainability leaders watching today are really trying to ensure that their organizations are remaining competitive. So, Marcus, I wonder if you could share three or so actions that companies should take in the next six to twelve months. Sure. I'm I'm happy to. I think, number one, would be sort of locking down key, reporting and disclosure related considerations, whether that's around your materiality determinations, sort of boundary considerations inclusive of suppliers, any estimating that you're doing. So just locking down that that regulatory, or stakeholder related pressure from a reporting and a disclosure standpoint, which in turn can can result in some of those value creation opportunities. So that's that's number one. Number two, I would consider centralization of of data and workflows like we've described into a controlled environment with with clear ownership and clear operating models, and a corresponding, audit trail, if you will, inclusive of of bringing in your external auditors, to to weigh in on those considerations. So that's that's number two, centralization. And then I think number three is is is moving to action. So again to what Josh described is we know that there's financial benefits for many of these activities and and and exercises and program in the stability domain. Moving on them, get ahead of the ones that provide maybe interoperability, like I mentioned, around reporting topics, act upon the ones that are gonna drive the the greatest value for your organization and stand up structures to support those programs. So those would be my my three sort of next six to twelve months, immediate actions for leading organizations. I can feel, people virtually scrabbling to take notes, so I did just want to remind people that this will be available to watch back for anyone who didn't manage to to catch those those three bits of wisdom or anything else that we've that we've discussed. Josh, I wonder if I can come to you next for for our advice. How should organizations structure governance to withstand future regulatory change? Yeah. That's that's a good one. I think that government has been, sort of in the background of probably most, if not all, of the, decisions that the sustainability function has, has had to make because there is such a a compliance requirement angle. So, if I think about, you know, public companies who are driven by, the board, oftentimes we have a sustainability, committee or subcommittee that, is within, under the purview of, say, the the nom, nom and gov, group, at a at a given company. And I think that that, represents for me probably the most effective, way of deploying governance, generally speaking. As we said before, I don't think that sustainability, I think sustainability is is critical and a key part of an organization's, a key and, probably increasingly important part of, in enterprise strategy, but doesn't necessarily always have the, the personnel and the capital assigned to it as possible. So, I think that what you can do in lieu of that is really find hooks, into the broader organizations. So for those groups that, are already, you know, key to different types of decision making and ensure that sustainability gets onto the agenda. So that's going to be, you know, your your chief compliance officer if appropriate. It's going to be potentially, legal, and others who are already dealing with a lot of these topics, but, may already have, some of the, more formal decision authority or ability to, get the right people to take a look at at what you're working on. And so I think that as the regulations evolve and progress, I think we're we're gonna be thrown, increasingly, more more curve balls. And so having a greater number of people out there who are able to, you're able to quickly bounce ideas off of and, then sort of identify the implications of a shifting, set of, of regulatory requirements is gonna be is gonna be key. So, again, just to to sort of summon, I I think that, you know, finding those different places where sustainability can sort of be, you know, more firmly embedded and and creating mechanisms to, to really get decisions, going within the organization, I think, is, is really critical there. I don't think anyone wants them, but I think we've all gotten quite used to those curveballs in sustainability reporting, especially over the past few years. Stephen, what about from your perspective? What are you seeing as standout qualities in companies who are leading the pack in this space or indeed those that might be lagging behind? Probably those that that are, you know, taking a bolder approach, not being timid about this. You know? The those that act quickly, the time, basically. Those that act now, are the ones that are are leading and that will lead. It's pretty simple. Brilliant. So if we look to 2027 and beyond, Steven, do you see sustainability reporting becoming fully embedded into financial reporting? Yeah. I I I think so. I mean, you know, there's a there's a p and l implication for all of these things. And when you have tools that can manage, risk, tools that can highlight the cost, associated with, with noncompliance, you know, the combination of the tools and the impact the impact that, that these topics have means that in inevitably, they'll be embedded in financial reporting, I believe. And I wonder if if you could all give a stab at me, give give it a stab to define mature sustainability capability in North America. Josh, do you wanna kick us off? Yeah. Sure. I think that when it comes to maturity around sustainability, I think it's going to be, largely guided by, how well the sustainability function has integrated with, with with the others who are helping them make those those decisions. And so, it's gonna be, you're gonna have a variety of different ways that that that sort of, appears in different organizations. So it may be process led. It may be that, you know, you've really got very strong documentation and standard operating procedures for, for the different sustainability topics you cover off on. For others, I think that it may be, more technology focused, establishing that, that critical audit trail, and providing more discrete pieces of information as to how different decisions were arrived at. But I do think that the core to the question of maturity, it will be this type of how deep is the actual embedding of the function. And, again, I think that, you know, there are a variety of different ways when it comes to the operating model, different sort of angles or trajectories that you can see, companies already applying. Again, some are more process first, some are more technology first. But I think that, you know, the the level of maturity is really dictated by, am I am I as embedded as I would be, and am I getting access to the right types of, of decisions that other functions are getting because that leads to, you know, the appropriate level of, sort of feedback into planning. It goes into budget and capital allocation. And I think that it eventually, you know, really shows you what success can look like as you, fully mature a capability. Love that, Josh. I think, I think you hit the nail on the head. I think mature sustainability capability is defined less by compliance or or regulatory compliance and more by that integration into, you know, core business operations just just as Josh described. I think the leaders are going to be those that treat sustainability as an enterprise capability. So with your ownership, clear controls, accountability, rather than just simply a regulatory or a communications exercise. And, of course, there's all the underlying structure required to do so, but agree with Josh that, leading organizations or a mature sustainability capability is gonna be about that integration into core business operations. Yeah. And from the from the Osapien side, I would say, you know, this integration and platform is is going to be key. I mean, we've been talking a lot about, disclosures and reporting, but there's a lot of emphasis now also on packaging and packaging waste regulation on European Union deforestation, which has been around a bit a bit longer than that. There is a focus on, on tools for responsible sourcing. So the big play here is being able to well, if I go back to SAP days, right, I mean, one of the innovations that SAP brought to the market was to say in 1972, hey. You can have different solutions for inventory management and human management and, and financial reporting, but why don't you put them all in together in one package, which was very compelling? I think we're at the phase at the stage right now where we're saying the same about sustainability. Why why not look at sustainability as a platform and use this a consistent platform as much as possible with a single code line to cover all of these topics altogether, that can bring an even higher level of, of of enterprise engagement, I believe. Brilliant. I wonder if if all three of you as well wouldn't mind rounding us off with sort of a key takeaway for our audience, when it comes to this space, either a piece of advice or or just sort of a a summarization of where we are in this moment. Josh, can we start with you again? Sure. Yeah. I think that the, the key piece of advice that I would, I would offer is to just continuously be, be scanning, and looking. So whether we're talking about, about the compliance, requirements that are are rapidly shifting globally, whether we're talking about, you know, what your your specific peers that are doing or maybe even not near peers, but sort of, you know, industry leaders or people that you're, you may have some aspirational, aspirational goals related to. I think that, if you if you step back and think about the arc of kind of sustainability as a capability or a function, we're still, you know, relatively speaking, quite young when you compare it to, finance, accounting, etcetera. And so, I think that, that this is, one of those one of those situations where the ability to look around and and kinda quickly integrate and bring in all that information and translate into what does this mean for my organization, and and do I need a specific, reaction? Do I need to do something within my, my company to, to sort of take a a counter position or to follow a trend? I think that that is a that is a critical place for, for you to kind of, constantly maintain a little bit of a little bit of headspace for because everything is, you know, moving extremely quickly, and we never quite know which, you know, which access we're gonna be on, you know, maybe even between the, tweets. So that's that's what I got. Just another curveball. Hey. Another curveball. Steven, what's your perspective? Yeah. I mean, I would say that there's some very exciting things happening out there among peers of almost every industry that we're covering. I mean, Osapiens people often say, what is Osapiens? It's Ono Sapiens in in Latin, not that I did Latin, but, it means knowledge shared. So understanding what others are doing, is is is of great value, which is somewhat cliche. But the point I would make is that even in companies that are competing with each other, they're still willing to share the knowledge and the experience that they've got around having a holistic and a unified approach to this. So listen to what others what others are doing. Attend those conferences. Listen to those and pay attention to those webinars. Marcus, what about you? I've already lost the question. If you wanna reask it, I'll try. Just asking for a for a sort of summary point, either a piece of advice or or an overview of where we are. It's important for leading organizations to stay the course and advance, activities in those domains that drive significant value like we described, those that, drive improved, disclosure and and reporting considerations, inclusive of audit readiness. I think making those tough decisions on on what is important and and what is not is is critical for for those organizations that wanna maintain a competitive advantage. Brilliant. Thank you so much to all three of you for your insights. Thank you so much for joining us today, and thank you to everyone who has joined us, for this webinar inside North America's sustainability shift, research, readiness, and reality. For more webinars, content, and sustainability leadership, you can follow Sustainability Magazine, check out our website, and subscribe to the newsletter. As Stephen says, it's important to be on the pulse with this sort of thing. Thank you all three of you again, and I hope you will enjoy the rest of your day.